Stock Options
sbpatel
via web
I've read everything I could find posted about tracking stock options. Unfortunately, I'm just not getting it. How would one enter a scenario where an employee was granted 100 options for Apple stock in Feb 2010 with a strike price of $10 and vesting period of 3 year (i.e. 1/3rd in 2011, 1/3rd in 2012, 1/3rd in 2013)?
sbp
2 Posted by paul.r.smith on 05 Nov, 2009 01:13 PM
I can't find this functionality either. Expiry Date would write off the shares if you took no action.
Support Staff 3 Posted by Angie Rauscher on 13 Nov, 2009 06:52 PM
Unfortunately Moneydance does not currently support Stock Options, although it is a feature that is on our road map. Our wiki is integrated with our feature request and bug reporting system. Please feel free to register and use these systems to help improve Moneydance by bringing bugs to our attention and requesting new features. A ticket requesting this feature can be found here, as well as one to add Yahoo Ticker support for stock options here. We now also have voting on all existing tickets, which helps us determine which requests have the most demand.
Please let me know if I can be of further assistance, and thank you for your interest in Moneydance.
Angie Rauscher
Moneydance Support
4 Posted by John Selden on 15 Nov, 2009 02:49 PM
Whoa wait. I thought Moneydance did support stock options. Take a look at the screenshot posted at:
http://help.infinitekind.com/discussions/switching-to-moneydance-fr...
If you select the "Add Security" button in the Securities Detail view of an investment account, stock options are one of the choices available in the dropdown menu. If this is somehow different than what you all are discussing, pardon my intrusion.
Support Staff 5 Posted by Angie Rauscher on 16 Nov, 2009 01:33 AM
My apologies, I was not specific. We do support stock options, but it is not a very sophisticated system, and to be honest I am not exactly sure it could track the case listed above. If anyone has experience with a similar situation, we would greatly appreciate hearing from you.
Please let me know if I can be of further assistance, and thank you for your interest in Moneydance.
Angie Rauscher
Moneydance Support
6 Posted by doppelstern on 22 Apr, 2010 11:43 AM
Re: sbp
"I've read everything I could find posted about tracking stock options. Unfortunately, I'm just not getting it. How would one enter a scenario where an employee was granted 100 options for Apple stock in Feb 2010 with a strike price of $10 and vesting period of 3 year (i.e. 1/3rd in 2011, 1/3rd in 2012, 1/3rd in 2013)?"
Here's what you do.
1) Go to the "Account" menu >> Select "New Account..." >> Select "Investment" for account type >> Enter your brokerage account info.
2) Click over to the newly created investment account >> Select "Securities Detail"
3) Select "Add Security" >> Select "New Security" >> Fill in the following fields like so -
Security ID: {your award/grant number}
Security Name: Apple {your award/grant number}
Ticker Symbol: AAPL
Price: {your exercise price}
Value Prefix: {leave blank}
Value Suffix: {leave blank}
Max. Decimal Places: {defaults at 4... leave it alone}
Show on Home Page? {deselect}
and click "OK"
4) Now fill in the following fields like so -
Broker: {your brokerage}
Phone Number: {your brokerage's phone number}
Type: Stock Option
Subtype: Incentive
Call or Put? Call
Stock Price: {your exercise price}
Exercise Price: {your exercise price}
Exercise Month: {only allows you to indicate an upcoming month right now, but I hope eventually we will be able to put in a full calendar date here}
Comments:
Feb 2010 Grant#{your award/grant number}
100 Options at {your exercise price} exp {your expiration date... 02/01/2020ish?}
and click "OK"
5) Repeat Steps 3 and 4 if you have more than one grant. If you also receive stock units (incentive awards of actual shares of stock) from Apple, and they are managed by the same brokerage in the same account, then you'll want to add AAPL as a separate security (Type: Stock / Subtype: Large Cap) - and don't deselect for it to show up on your Home Page. Do not synchronize your stock quotes at this point.
6) Click into the "Register" view inside your Investment account. Create the following New Transactions:
02/01/2011 ; Buy ; Description: "Stock Option Grant" ;
Memo: "Award #{your grant/award number} 1/3" ; Cleared ;
"Apple {your grant/award number}" ; {blank} ; Shares: "33" ; Price: {will auto-fill as your exercise price} ; etc.
02/01/2012 ; Buy ; Description: "Stock Option Grant" ;
Memo: "Award #{your grant/award number} 2/3" ; Cleared ;
"Apple {your grant/award number}" ; {blank} ; Shares: "33" ; Price: {will auto-fill as your exercise price} ; etc.
02/01/2013 ; Buy ; Description: "Stock Option Grant" ;
Memo: "Award #{your grant/award number} 3/3" ; Cleared ;
"Apple {your grant/award number}" ; {blank} ; Shares: "34" ; Price: {will auto-fill as your exercise price} ; etc.
7) Repeat Step 6 as necessary for your other grants/awards (create a new transaction for each anticipated vesting event). Once you're finished, you can synchronize your stock prices. I use the Stock Quote Synchronizer extension to do this. Works like a charm.
8) Lastly, click into "Securities Detail" and fix your "History" section for each of your option-specific securities. Select the security from the drop-down up top >> Select "History" >> Select "Import..." >> Select "Import From File" >> Browse to wherever you saved the file that you got from Yahoo Finance
http://finance.yahoo.com/q/hp?s=AAPL+Historical+Prices
(click on the "Download to Spreadsheet" link at the bottom of the page)
and once all those real price quotes are in, select the remaining prices that Moneydance auto-imported "from transactions associated with the security" and click "Remove" to get rid of them (because the strike price is not helpful when it's throwing off your price history).
Now when you look at the "Portfolio View" of your Investment account, you'll see a list of grant-specific securities including Apple proper, Apple XXXX, Apple YYYY, etc. for your stock units and stock options. Your Asset Allocation will be a pretty little pie chart split between "Stock: Large Cap" and "Stock Option: Incentive." Your Cost Basis will be {contracted shares x strike price}, and your Cash Balance will be exactly the negative of your Cost Basis. % Change will accurately reflect percent change between the current stock price and your strike price. And Total will reflect what your stock units and stock options would hypothetically net you today - if all shares were vested and bought and sold this instant.
Of course this method is not perfect, since the Cash Balance is negative. But at least the "Total" works out correctly (if you don't mind pretending like everything has already vested) and contributes the mathematically correct amount to Net Worth.
Support Staff 7 Posted by Angie Rauscher on 24 Apr, 2010 03:48 PM
Dopplestern,
Thanks for this great and detailed description. Would you be okay with me using it as the basis as a knowledge base/FAQ article? I would of course credit you, using whatever name you prefer.
Do let me know, and thank you for your thoughts on this occasionally sticky issue.
Angie Rauscher
Moneydance Support
8 Posted by paul.r.smith on 29 Jul, 2010 05:23 PM
While Doppelstern's workround is quite neat, it still doesn't address the main issues of options. I would like to:-
o track an option's total current value against it's total option value.
o be able to track vesting and expiry dates
o not have the value included in the the total asset value as value is only created when you trade the option.
(I know I shouldn't say it, but the MS M***y routine hits the spot.)
Anyway, I hope to see the enhancement soon.
Moneydance is still the best in the ma
9 Posted by Mark on 07 Aug, 2010 04:56 AM
I would also add my voice here. I have just migrated; think think Moneydance is v good, BUT, not having this simple option of tracking employee share options is not great. There must be many of us who have exactly the same requirements as posted by Paul.
Please move this development up the timeframe, it is important for your users. Microsoft Money tracking of options was ideal.
Support Staff 10 Posted by Angie Rauscher on 07 Aug, 2010 06:02 AM
Thank you all for your input, I am passing it on to our developer. I agree that improvements to the stock option functions of Moneydance are an important feature.
I have created a ticket for this issue. The ticket is attached to this discussion. By posting in this discussion your interest in the ticket has been registered. This is equivalent to voting for it.
Please let me know if I can be of further assistance,
Angie Rauscher
Moneydance Support
11 Posted by paul.r.smith on 07 Aug, 2010 12:03 PM
That's good news!
On re-reading #402, I think that is a very good analysis of what's needed, but given that ticket was opened four years ago, what is the likely timescale for this enhancement?
Regards,
Paul Smith
Support Staff 12 Posted by Angie Rauscher on 09 Aug, 2010 02:43 AM
Paul,
I'm sorry to say I don't have a timescale at the moment but I expect we will be having a development meeting in the next few weeks. Hopefully we'll be able to release an outline of our expected progress for the next few months after that meeting. Thanks for sticking with us!
Angie Rauscher
Moneydance Support
13 Posted by spark on 25 Aug, 2010 10:06 PM
Just adding another voice to say yes please, this is the top of my wishlist as well. Thanks!
14 Posted by sean on 19 Sep, 2010 07:26 PM
Another request for option tracking!
If the full TRAC#402 is too hard to implement - then can we at least have a transaction type of Grant, Vest and Expire? -- then I can use Doppelstern's method without upsetting the cash balance. (Since a vest is like a buy without requiring any cash)
15 Posted by sean on 26 Sep, 2010 07:56 AM
I don't think that the 'doppelstern method' posted above will calculate correctly when the options are underwater.
It would be awesome if 'vest' were available as a security transaction type -- where vest differed from a buy in value. Vest can never be negative...
if grant price < current price
vest value = (current price - grant price)*shares
else
vest value = 0
Support Staff 16 Posted by Angie Rauscher on 27 Sep, 2010 03:45 AM
Hi all,
We're using a new request and bug tracking system which is integrated with our forums. The tickets for these requests are attached to this discussion (including the original trac tickets). By posting in this discussion your interest in the ticket has been registered. This is equivalent to voting for it. We will post on this forum thread if and when there are further developments on this topic.
Please let me know if I can be of further assistance,
Angie Rauscher
Moneydance Support
17 Posted by batwell on 25 Nov, 2010 03:33 PM
I know that this isn't very high priority but given that it has been on the books for over 5 years now, is there some way to raise the priority other than by the number of votes? I would really like to see this implemented soon.
Bob.
18 Posted by Al on 26 Nov, 2010 11:00 AM
A site that I have found to be very helpful for beginners is (http://www.optionsimple.com). Good luck.
19 Posted by Denis Z. on 04 Jan, 2011 08:47 AM
Hi,
Adding another voice to the thread here. A recent Quicken/PC to MD/Mac convert here.
The workaround is very detailed but adding a separate transaction for each vesting event when there are 48 vesting events per grant hardly seems feasible. Also, it would be great to add the same vesting option for Restricted Stock grants that have a vesting schedule as well. While I really like MD overall, I have to say that Quicken had a great wizard to set these up.
Thanks,
Denis
20 Posted by JPierson on 13 Jan, 2011 03:22 AM
I used Dopplestern's steps to set up my options and restricted grants when I joined my company last year. Now, however, my first round of options are going to vest. But I don't necessarily intend to exercise them at this point. I guess if I were using his method (and the example) that they would stay Apple XXX until I actually exercise the options, at which time I'd transfer them to just Apple?
Anyway, I'd like to see this as an actual supported feature in MD.
Thanks,
JPierson
21 Posted by Brett on 19 May, 2011 02:28 AM
another vote...trying to fill the glass until it spills over and gets implemented!
thanks in advance,
brett
22 Posted by AlanK on 02 Jun, 2011 11:36 PM
I vote for a compensatory options feature as well.
23 Posted by Chuck on 07 Jun, 2011 12:17 PM
Another vote
24 Posted by Richard on 12 Jul, 2011 02:48 PM
Another vote - interesting in migrating from Quicken, but I have been tracking 10+ option grants with monthly vesting after the first 12 months, which means doppelstern's method would require me to create HUNDREDS of register entries by hand.
25 Posted by Trevor on 21 Jul, 2011 07:43 AM
another vote
26 Posted by Zandy on 26 Jul, 2011 02:47 AM
I was a MS Money user since 1997. When they stopped supporting it, I switched to Quicken and now hate it. I have been looking for a replacement and I would buy Moneydance in an instant IF it supported ISO grants. Until it does so, I will stick with Quicken and suffer because it is less painful than the workaround that doppelstern laid out.
27 Posted by Stuart Beesley on 09 Aug, 2011 07:16 AM
Another vote here - me too please! Thanks